Good morning and welcome back to another exciting week!
Weekend was really nice- Lauren and Joseph came up for a visit; Lauren had a girlfriend gathering in Albany on Saturday, so Sherri and I were on call for the whole day! Needless to say, we were both a little exhausted when they left Sunday afternoon! It was so good to spend time with them! They will be with us this summer (June through August) until Lauren finds a permanent position. Her husband, Chris, is teaching an on-line course trough Ball State University, so he can be anywhere; they want to move closer to family (Saratoga Springs area and here). Busy summer for us!
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| Ice cream cake for Mom's birthday! |
Jack had mentioned, and I think we had talked earlier, of setting up a weekly Zoom chat. I will send out email today to see what day and time would be best for us all. I only have a "free" zoom account- so we are limited to 40 minutes- but that can get us started. Those of us in the area can maybe gather soon for a meet and greet too- now that weather is allowing us to meet outside.
The next three chapters we will see a change in Paul's writing. The first eight chapters were about the need for God and the provisions God made for us through Christ and the Spirit. I think we have a good handle on that. The next three chapters, Paul turns to Israel and Paul's love for the Jewish people. Paul is very troubled that his people (he was once a Jew) turned away God. What does this say about Israel- that they missed the Messiah? What does this say about God? What does this say about us?
We see Paul's anguish almost immediately in this chapter. Paul ended chapter 8 with the great words that so many of you commented on, "What can separate us from the love of God? Nothing!" But, then he remembers the nation of Israel, and how they are separated from the "love of God." In dramatic declaration, Paul says that he would rather be separated from God if this would solidify Israel's salvation (v 3). This is more than just drama though, as Paul declared in the first verse how honest and truthful he wants to be about this discussion. Paul's comment here is similar to Moses (Exodus 32:31-32) when Moses says (my words), "I know they made a golden calf as their god, but if you forgive them God, you can blot me out of the Book of Life." Two great leaders would rather be condemned then to see their nation lost. What compassion! Keep in mind that these people (the Jews) were the same ones that stirred up trouble every time Paul came to town- wanting to stone him, lock him up, persecute him! But, Paul still loves them, they are his people (v 3). Do we have people like that in our life? They may mistreat us and hurt us, yet we have a strong desire to pull them toward God? If we don't, should we?
The pain Paul feels is amplified by the tome and effort God has spent with them (vv 4-5). Covenants, laws, promises, descendants (even Jesus was of Jewish heritage!). All of this makes Israel's rejection even tougher and more unbelievable. Paul ends this section with a divine declaration that Christ and God are the same (V 5b).
Paul puts the "blame" entirely on Israel. "God did not faith you Israel, you failed God!" (v 6). People may look at Israel and say "Well, God didn't keep up God's end of the deal!" Wrong. Only those that followed God and were ruled by God (Israel) were the ones. The word "Israel" means "governed by God" and what Paul is saying here is that not all the people of Israel were really people of "Israel." Think of people that call themselves Christians- are they really? Even though the nation was called Israel, only some were truly governed by God, only some were really followers of God.
Paul brings up two examples for us to think about. Not all of Abraham's descendants were "chosen"; it was only the descendants of Isaac (vv 7-9). Consider Ishmael; he was a descendant of Abraham with Hagar. Ishmael is a "child of the flesh" while Isaac is a "child of the Spirit/promise" (remember how/why Ishmael was born and why/how Isaac was born). It is relatively easy why God chose Isaac rather than Ishmael to be the lineage of the promise; it is more difficult in the next example of Jacob and Esau (vv 10- 13). It is not easy for us to understand, but for some reason, God chose Jacob over Esau even before they were born (so it is not a "works based" decision). God announced to Rebekah that the older will serve the younger (very contrary to Judaic customs). Interesting, but confusing side note, Rebekah is a relative of Nahor- a brother to Abraham; Isaac and Rebekah were therefore cousins (possibly to emphasize the importance of this family lineage). Anyway, God said, "Jacob I have loved, Esau I have hated" (Malachi 1:2-3). Hated is a strong word- I like to think "loved less" in this case; I don't think God hates. Esau was blessed with good crops and animals and lifestyle; it was the inheritance of the covenant that God is not liking Esau for.
When God does this, God isn't being unfair or unrighteous (v 14). God clearly explains to Moses (v 15) that God can give God's grace and mercy to whomever God pleases (Exodus 33:19). Those of us that have more than one child- are they treated equally in all cases or do we tend to show more mercy and grace to one kid at one time and another kid at a different time? But, we still love our kids- right? We get to a dangerous point when we think God's mercy to us is our right- or God's obligation to us as God!
God has the right, as does any creator (potter in v 21), to do whatever the creator wishes to do. Tough words, but true words (v 1). If God wants to pour more mercy out on one person- are we to question that? If God wants to be more fair to someone, can we question that? The Jews were inclined to think that because God said the words God did, they could be no less than others. Paul rejects that idea and points out that God can do what God wants to do! Again- tough words!
Paul then uses words from the prophets Hosea and Isaiah to emphasize the points he has been trying to make. God will call those originally destined as "not my people" to be included in God's plan (vv 25-26). God showed mercy to some of Israel during the Assyrian destruction and exile (vv 27-29). God could have let the entire nation be destroyed (as happened in Sodom and Gomorrah), but God allowed some of Israel to survive. Again, tough words to hear!
What do we have so far: the Gentiles found righteousness even though they didn't look for it; Israel seemed to work for the righteousness, but they couldn't find it (vv 30-32). The clincher verse is next. Why did this happen? The Gentiles came to God through faith; the Jews were trying to win God's favor through works and actions. Israel seems to be cast away, but they lacked faith!
I hope this made some sense. This biggest point Paul is trying to make is that faith is critical in acceptance by God. God doesn't look for actions- although actions will be a product of our faith- God is looking for faith.
Tomorrow we continue with the rejection of Jesus by Israel.
Enjoy the day and have a good one!
Shalom+
Pastor Paul
Awwww - grandchildren - life's greatest gift!
ReplyDeleteThere are times when I totally understand the concept of the Holy Trinity. However, there are times when I don't. And after reading Chapter 8 I am more on the "I don't get it" side. I reread 5b because you said that Paul states that Christ and God are the same - but my 5b is not that clear - it does say that Christ was made flesh and it does say in my Bible's commentary that it is the clearest statement in the NT about the trinity. but, then, who exactly, is Jesus praying to in the garden of Gethsemane. Paul says Christ made flesh - it doesn't say that Christ was made flesh and still remained in heaven. Where did the idea of the Holy Trinity actually start?
I do think Paul loved his kinsmen (and he was still a Jew) as he also loved being Roman. And I think his offer to be "sacrificed" for their sake was very genuine. I don't think there are many that I would sacrifice my salvation for - especially if those people hated me as much as the Jews hated Paul. I should, I agree, but....
This chapter is very upsetting. It seems to say on the one hand that God loves us unconditionally. BUT on the other hand it says God does make choices, even before we are born. it seems like Paul is saying that God makes decisions on how he interacts with men - individually - makes decisions. And it seems like from the examples presented, these decisions that God makes aren't based on actions OR faith - since they are made before birth. How can this be? And, my commentary says that the word hate really means rejected. I agree - God does not hate. But it does seem like there is some sort of wrath (word may be harsh) projected by God to the Jews, whom He loved and chose all through the OT, suddenly says that Jews are not His children.
With all the covenants that have been made, that Paul has stated, will God make another one? All the other covenants prior have been broken or set aside for new covenants - will this one as well? Is Jesus' second coming the end of the world the same as the Rapture? Or could it be that Jesus' second coming will be another covenant to another group of people?
I think this chapter clearly points out why God "rejects" Israel but it doesn't show (at least to me) why Israel rejected Jesus. More to come?
The concept of the Trinity is an interesting one and is never really fully developed in our New Testament. It is an attempt by humans to describe three separate and distinct aspects of a divine God, yet they are coeternal and cosubstantial. THere are a few possible references in the Hebrew scripture (three visitors to Abraham, for example), but there was no real "need" for a trinity- no Jesus. Pope Clement of Rome (late 80s) was the first to attempt to discuss the trinity. The Council of Nicea (Nicene Creed) in 325AD, to "combat" Arianism (the idea that Jesus is not divine but fully human) really emphasized God and Jesus as one (if you read the creed you will see this); not so much about the Holy Spirit. When the council met in Constantinople in early 380AD, the Holy Spirit was added as one of the Trinity. THere is lots more but this is the beginning of "the Trinity"
DeleteThe point you make about God selecting is the primary theology of the Calvinist and predestination: some are elected, some are not. It does seem as though God selected a certain branch to be elected- but if there is faith by someone else- can they be "granted" election to salvation? I go with "yes!"
I do think the word wrath is appropriate. I see the God of the Hebrew scriptures as very vindictive and punishes lots. People compare that God to a parent that may punish to help their children stay safe. I don't know!
To your other point- to me, it seems like only some of the Jews are selected as God's chosen people. I'm not sure- remember- this is Paul's interpretation of the words of the Hebrew scriptures. Is Paul trying to help the Jews be OK with their "rejection" of Jesus and more "accepting" of the Gentiles? I'm not sure if I agree with all that Paul says, but it makes for some interesting discussion.
Your question about covenants is great. Jesus is the most "recent" covenant- but I have had several people ask the same question you ask- Will God come up with another promise/covenant? One hypothesis by some theologians is that Christ's second coming will "impose" a new covenant and there will be new "rules" (for lack of better words) to follow. So much is obviously unknown!
It seems as though God has rejected Israel; did Israel reject God because of that? If you are not loved by someone, do you continue to love them?
More to come! I hope!
Great thoughts!
you can feel Paul's frustration with the Jews for not believing that faith is their salvation not by abiding by the laws He says he is willing to die for them, of course, his death will not save them only Jesus can do that .
ReplyDeleteThe Jews mostly continue to not believe only in the law.
What's the saying "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink" I think this was the case of the Jews
Does God decide who will be saved and who won't or his just there watching us as we make our decisions to not follow him. he did give us free will I believe. Some of the chapter is so OT again putting God as not the good God but a God that is hateful This is hard for me as the God in he NT is so loving . Paul does seem to change before the end of chapter saying that because the Gentiles have faith the are God's are his children
It seems like Paul is saying that the Dam is the river is Jesus and we need to get over it the find salvation.
Pastor Paul looks like you had a great weekend with family Joseph is a sweetheart but it is tiring taking care of youngsters as we get older. There is a reason I guess why we have children when we are young. (Can't imagine Sarah and Abraham having a child at their ages alto not sure that was exactly the age as it is today)
Family is so great and it's so wonderful to be able to be together and close.
And it was so good to be back at church yesterday being there is so much better that watching on FB alto thank God for it when needed.
I do feel Paul's frustration, yet I also see the Jews moving away from God a result of their free will- like you say. It seems as though God was selecting a specific lineage to be the chosen ones- can you fault the Jews for not following God? It is difficult for us to see the Hebrew God= anger, wrath, vengeance. I do like the New Testament God much better- love, compassion, trust. I think part of this chapter focuses on the Gentiles, so that maybe the Jews will be more accepting of them?
DeletePaul desires the Jews to stop following "the laws" but they have done it for thousands and thousands of years. It is hard to change- we see that in the church today and we are only two thousand years old!
I guess we need to continue in our quest for faith and grow the faith that we have!
Great weekend- but I am exhausted!
Thanks for your thoughts Clara!
Well, I am trying not to be negative today, so I will just say that I still do not believe that Paul totally had all the answers. He wasn’t God, Jesus or devine in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteI know that Paul says that only by faith are we redeemed. I think God loves all people and doesn’t have to follow the “rules” (laws).
Yesterday I wrote about those who are not lucky enough to be in a circle of people who learn about what we feel will save us. It’s really bothered me. Then I started to think that God loves all his children and wants good for all. So why am I worried? I trust that God will take care of us all.
That's a great comment Cathy! I agree- Paul doesn't know all. He is interpreting the Hebrew scriptures just like we do when we read them. He has a specific theology that he is attempting to address and a point he is trying to make. So, he selects scripture to work with. Is it divine intervention? The men that put these letters in the Bible thought so.
DeleteMy God does love all people and my God does accept all if they have faith that God is God. Although there is one God in Christian theology- that God is different for each person.
Your words also resonated with me yesterday. I have a list of ideas for our church to begin thinking about; ways tat we can get the message to people in a non-threatening way; ways to show God's love without being too preachy. It is up to "us" to show "them" that God does care and God is love. It is a tough thing to do in this world though!
Thanks for the thoughts and honesty!
I forgot to say! Today is Cindy’s birthday 🎈🎈🎈
ReplyDeleteThanks for the note!
DeleteI have to agree with Donna and will go one step further. I don't get it. This chapter was so over my head that I don't think I will ever understand it. I will take a couple of stabs at it, though.
ReplyDeleteAs Donna said, it appears that God has made his selection of who he "likes" (for lack of a better word) in the case of Jacob and Esau, before they were born. I agree that God doesn't hate, but this is troubling. Does he like one person over the next. In my own case, when we were growing up, I always felt that I was inferior to my younger brother. He was better looking, was more athletic and was more "with it". I was pretty nerdy and not athletically inclined. I didn't care about sports, but, in my youth, that was not an option. If you weren't into sports, you were a true zero. Does God feel and
act the same way. I don't think that I was hated, but I think my brother was liked more then me (not by my parents, but by others).
Paul really has it in for Israel in this chapter. I find this unexpected as Israel was always the "chosen people" (or so I thought).
In this chapter, Paul seems to drive home that God and Jesus look for faith rather than actions and deeds. I think that by faith, Jesus is saying that you have faith that he existed, did his wonderful work and died on the cross so that we could live. After that, he was resurrected from the dead and ascended into heaven and is seated on the right hand of God. I have struggled with this for most of my life. I have wondered: "Did this really happen?" This engineer in me ways "Could this have actually happened?" This is where Rhea has told me that I have to have faith. Is this what Paul is alluding to in this chapter?
Happy birthday, Cindy!!! (And many, many more.)
Joseph is really getting big. And he has more hair than I do! You are absolutely correct that it is tiring taking care of the little ones. We sat with our three granddaughters last night so that Kristin and her parents could go out to dinner before they left for Nevada today. They were good, but it was good to get home.
You open with some tough words, Jack. The Calvinists and the theology of predestination use passages like these to "solidify" their idea that God "elects" some for salvation and some not. It does trouble me to hear this! I do believe that my God loves all people- that love may be shown differently- but it is a universal emotion of my God.
DeleteFaith is a difficult concept and thought! In many scriptures we hear "we are saved by faith" or "we are justified by faith" and that is the premise that we go on.
For people like us, with a science mind, faith is tough. We like hard solid evidence and data to back up our claims! There is so much more for me to learn!
Thanks for your honest comments Jack.
No matter how many times I re-read this, typos always get through. In the fourth paragraph, I neglected to capitalize "He and His". In the same paragraph, in the next to last line, the word "ways" should be "says."
ReplyDeleteOops.